good morning, it is 10:00 eastern. i'm ana cabrera alongside jose diaz-balart for special breaking news coverage. donald trump's hush money trial is back under way in a manhattan courtroom and a significant witness is in the courthouse this morning, as proceedings get under way. adult film star stormy daniels, who we learned is expected to testify today. nbc's vaughn hillyard is at the courthouse. here with me in new york for the hour, danny cevallos, criminal defense attorney, catherine christian, former assistant manhattan district attorney and jeremy solan, former attorney in the manhattan d.a.'s office. vaughn, kick us off, we have a witness on the stand right now, who we'll get to in a moment, but, again, this morning we expect stormy daniels at some point today to take the stand and the judge before the jury

was even called in already set some parameters around her expected testimony. fill us in. >> reporter: right. some could say this was a long time coming. this began all the way back in 2006, the celebrity golf tournament in lake tahoe, when donald trump met stormy daniels. adult film star. and that was when the alle alle one night stand took place. fast-forward to 2016, it has been chronicled by many people around the effort to silence stormy daniels' story with that $130,000 payment that she was prepared to come forward and share her story publicly in the weeks before the 2016 election. now, today, may 7th, 2024, stormy daniels herself is inside the very courthouse where donald trump, the criminal defendant, is. this is a moment here where prosecutors intend to show that

stormy daniels' story could have been explosive, and her publicly sharing the details of her alleged encounter with donald trump, which she has denied the details of, could have impacted the 2016 presidential election because of what she was prepared to show. as to exactly what details she can chronicle in front of this jury, before the jurors entered the courthouse here this morning, guys, there was discussion back and forth between judge merchan, the prosecution, and donald trump's defense team over the extent to the details that she could chronicle. the defense for donald trump argued that she should not be able to go into explicit details about the sexual acts that she alleges, saying it would be unduly prejudicial to donald trump, the defendant. the -- on the other hand, the prosecution made the case that this was important for the jury to understand why this story mattered and why the details of it could have had such repercussions. the prosecution, though, said that stormy daniels would not

describe genitalia or anything, but saying, quote, it is important to us to elicit she had sex with him and how she felt about it, that they would need to elicit the fact that stormy and donald trump had sex, to which judge merchan said in return that that was fine, but we don't need to know the details of the intercourse. so, there you have it. we should expect to see stormy daniels at some point here take the stand to detail the allegations that she had sexual relations with donald trump back in 2006, and was prepared to share her story in the weeks leading up to the 2016 election before she, through her own attorney, secured that $130,000 and her story was never published. >> and, vaughn, meanwhile, what can you tell us about sally franklin, the witness on the stand now, she's being crossed. >> reporter: yes, sally franklin is a svp, senior vice president

over at -- i'm looking up here, the publishing company, random house publishing group. she and the company were the ones that published several of donald trump's books. and what the prosecution is having her do right now is not because she knows donald trump or knows any of the details about the specifics of this case, but instead she's reading a couple key passages that they wanted the jury to hear as evidence as part of this trial, including from his book "think like a billionaire," in which she is reading a passage that saying, quote, they sent checks and amounts from 50 cents to $5, i received a check for 50 cents and we at the trump organization deposited it. i always sign my checks so i know where my money is going. the chapter is "how to pinch pennys". there was another excerpt from the book "how to get rich" by donald trump and sally franklin red this to the jury, sometimes

you still have to screw them. for many years i said if someone screws you, screw them back. an eye for an eye. this for the jury is just evidence the prosecution wanted to hear that donald trump has a long history of viewing revenge in this sort of a manner here and this is ahead of stormy daniels, who he has denied the allegations of, but the prosecution makes the case that he just wants to fight back and fight hard against the claims she makes. >> okay, vaughn, stand by and keep us posted as this witness testimony continues. it seems like the testimony with sally franklin is going very quickly. the cross is over. redirect is back in action now. so the prosecution asking a few follow-up questions, but with this witness, they're using her to read some passages from past trump books that may apply to this particular trial. vaughn read a couple that she read out loud to the jurors, a couple more that stand out to me, if you don't know every aspect of what you're doing down

to the paper clips, you're setting yourself up for some welcome surprises. clearly, that's to point out how detail oriented trump was, right? >> and hands on. he also says the words are coming out of his mouth from the book, when you're dealing with decorators, make sure you review the invoices, what head of the company looks at decorator invoices, a hands on micromanaging donald trump. that's what the prosecution would argue. he knows the financial details. he's hands on. he talks about wheeze weisselbeg the ultimate manager and very loyal, this is setting the prosecution's theory for the jury to say, this is not an aloof hands off manager, he's very involved. >> he knew about the payments and he knew the payments were falsified as legal payments in the records with the trump organization. that's what they're trying to prove here to the jury. meantime, another excerpt from the book, i wonder if it is setting up for the testimony to come, all the women on the apprentice flirted with me,

consciously or unconsciously, that's to be expected. a sexual dynamic is always present between people unless you are asexual. significant? >> trump has been saying outrageous things for really about 50 years. there is no surprise that the people were going to bring in evidence of something he had written or said and it would be pretty much on the nose, just like this is. but as direct was going on, in the back of my mind, i was thinking on cross, are they going to go after the point that we all heard for years that donald trump mostly ghost wrote these books, but somebody else did the writing for him, and sure enough on cross, it appears that's exactly what they did. but take a step back and think about that. so they're making the point on cross, hey, this book that donald trump says he wrote, he didn't actually write it. doesn't that create the air of deception, kind of, that here is this book that donald trump said he wrote, but the defense here is that he didn't really write it, someone else wrote it, and that doesn't explain how would the ghost writer know about allen weisselberg or other things that appear in the book?

so, interesting point to say, well, donald trump may not have said those things, if they were ghost written. why did he put his name on them? a problematic area of cross, but this was always going to happen. i just didn't know from where and it might be books, it might be interviews, but donald trump has been saying outrageous things for a very long time. so, inevitably someone was going to find something like this that feels really on the nose, but, of course, the defense is going to argue, that was just a book that was really puffery, it is not really what happened in this situation. >> but, it does apply to the context of this case. jeremy, just some interesting color coming from the courtroom about how trump is behaving, his demeanor, we're reporting that he's engaged, he's been writing on a note pad, he's been talking to his attorney, blanche, and what is your take? you've been on both sides, the prosecution and the defense in your professional career. how do you see this? >> i see this witness as one of many witnesses that are filling the gaps, you don't look at it each witness in a vacuum.

you look at them building and bolstering the credibility of one another, ultimately getting up to michael cohen's sort of support, his statement and what he's going to say. and i was looking down here, one of the statements you made before, about you are setting yourself up for some unwelcome surprises, this is not a surprise. it may be unwelcome, but it is not a surprise. that's the theory and the argument of the prosecution. he knew what he was doing. he had his hands on everything from the paper clips to the decorator to the invoices to the black pen to sign the signature, and it is not a surprise, just unwelcome he found himself in this spot. >> everybody stay with us for a second. i think we have an update, jose? >> yes, let's go to vaughn hillyard. what's the latest? >> reporter: right, you were talking about the ghost writer situation and the implying by todd blanche, donald trump's attorney, that to a certain extent the ghost writers are the ones that are actually crafting the book, not donald trump himself. so on redirect, when the prosecution was able to ask him

questions as sally franklin questions further, made it very specifically, do ghost writers ever create content without any input from authors? franklin responding, no. does any author work for a ghost writer, does a ghost writer work for the author? the publisher responding, no, the ghost writer works for the author. again, hitting at the point that, no, the author, donald trump, is responsible for the words and the contents of the book, that it is not the ghost writer. and if i may, this seems look we kind of have this conversation around the last 48 hours and now we're having this conversation in real time about whether it is ghost writers who are the authors who are responsible for the words inside of their books. >> vaughn, thanks for that update. jeremy, what do you think about all that? >> hearing that, i think to myself, is the argument going to be that michael cohen is sort of the ghost writer? because if michael cohen is the ghost writer, he's still getting the input from who? from donald trump. the question, the request, the

ask, the agreement, where is it coming from? that ghost writer, if it michael cohen, it is coming initially, born from the mouth of donald trump to michael cohen to his hands and following through. that's going to be part of the theory of the prosecution. so it falls into that same sort of line of questioning that they need to get to that end. >> we don't believe michael cohen is the ghost writer of this book. so, catherine, does it matter who is? >> no, but as jeremy's point, there is -- the only witness who is going to testify that donald trump was really hands on and involved in this is michael cohen. so, so far every other witness has corroborated michael cohen, and what michael cohen did, took money out of the bank, wired it to stormy's lawyer, they corroborated that. but yesterday's witnesses, donald trump can't tell us what to do, it came from weisselberg. donald trump wasn't involved in that. it came from michael cohen.

michael cohen, to jeremy's point, he's donald trump's ghost writer, if you believe the words came from donald trump's mouth, you can believe michael cohen when he says donald trump told me to do this, donald trump told me to pay her off because he wanted to hide this from the electorate. so, that's what the prosecution are doing because michael cohen, keeps talking about his baggage and his credibility issues, they need this jury to believe michael cohen. because if they don't, quite frankly, then they should quit because he is in many ways that main witness that puts donald trump there. all of these other witnesses are very important, they put all the pieces together, but michael cohen is the one who is going to say that donald trump and the -- they're going to be read the law, request, solicited, commanded, the need to do this. >> danny, do you think the cross examination of this witness and others has been effective? has the defense done much so far to poke holes in the prosecution's case? >> yes, but we're in the

prosecution's case in chief. so, after each witness, you can say, well, that was a good witness for the prosecution, because if they weren't a good witness, the prosecution never would have called them. so, yes, so far, if you're keeping score, this is always where you are in the case. it is the middle of the prosecution's case in chief, they're always ahead, but at the end, the defense gets to put on a case, if they choose to, they sometimes they don't, frequently in most cases they put on no evidence, but at the end of the day, it is the burden of proof that you can rely on. i don't think that the trump defense is only going to rely on the burden of proof. they're going to have their own witnesses and their own evidence. i think the cross examination has gone exactly where it could go. i don't think it has been -- i don't think it has been a disaster. i think they have hit all the points that you would have to hit, with each of these witnesses, so i think if you're on the defense, you're thinking, hey, look, things aren't looking fantastic right now, but we're on schedule. >> i'm just looking at the google document, to see what is happening in the courtroom right now, looks like they're

admitting a bunch of these passages from the different trump books that they had in court here. in one in particular, trump, "how to get rich" is the name of the particular book they're entering the dedication page, the introduction, the acknowledgements in that book, so that's all going into the record officially. everyone, please stand by. jose? >> everyone at home, stay with us. we will continue monitoring this with all the developments from inside the courthouse in new york. and donald trump's hush money trial after a quick 90-second break. y trial after a quick 90-second break. [ cellphone ringing ] phone call from the boss? sorry. outdoor time is me time. i hear that. that's why we protect all your vehicles here. but hey...nothing wrong with sticking it to the boss. ooooh, flo, you gonna take that? why would that concern me? because you're...the... aren't you the..? huh...we never actually discussed hierarchy. ok, why don't we just stick to letting dave know how much he can save when he bundles his home or auto with his boat or rv.

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(jen) now we're even smarter and ready for what's next. (vo) achieve enterprise intelligence. it's your vision, it's your verizon. we're back -- >> we're back with special coverage -- >> we're back with the special coverage of the developments from the courtroom in lower manhattan, where a publishing executive is on the stand right now, testifying about some of former president trump's books, but soon stormy daniels is expected to take the stand. >> and joining me here in miami, msnbc legal contributor katie phang. good morning. what are we hearing this morning and what is the building block process from the prosecution to having her on the stand? >> so, she is a critical part of this case, not because of the salaciousness of what happened between her and donald trump, but because she can actually serve to get context, which is always important, if you're the

prosecution. none of this is happening in a vacuum. you always want to be able to give the jury an idea of why, right? we always talk about the who, the what, the where, the why, the when, the how. the jury is going to want to know why. and stormy daniels was the crux or the basis for the hush money payments and more importantly what is this case about, jose, falsification of business records. she, as in stormy daniels, is the basis for the falsification of general ledgers and other things that are going on. we currently have sally franklin on the stand, though, and what sally franklin, she is one of those custodians of records. we always talk about, you know, you want to see, right, marquee names like stormy daniels. someone like sally franklin, why is this woman on the stand? >> she's essentially the chief lbrarian of a publishing company. >> the prosecution doesn't use somebody like sally franklin as a custodian of record, they're not able to get certain pieces

of evidence in. and if you're in the jury, the rules of evidence are that unless it is actually in, you're not going to be able to see it, touch it, hear it, experience it, right? and so if the prosecution wants the jury to hear certain portions of books as we can see, which is actually damning for donald trump, the fact he's so frugal, he's a micromanager, he has his hands in everything, you use somebody like sally franklin because she allows the foundation to be laid to authenticate these passages in the books so the jurors can hear these excerpts and see them for themselves. >> so, now going back to stormy daniels, which we expect any minute now, in the near future, to take the stand. how -- do prosecutors have to be careful about the line of questioning they have with her, so that it doesn't -- it continues to be relevant to the

accusations and it doesn't become a telemundo telenovela script? >> so you have gone to law school, because you know that evidence has to be relevant. if it is not, it is never admissible to a jury. in this instance, the judge had oral arguments before the jury came in, the orders have had oral arguments with judge merchan about the scope of her testimony, what can stormy daniels get into. the prosecution telling the judge, as we heard have vaughn hillyard, we need to make sure that the jury understands why this story was so important in terms of impact and in terms of consequence. if it was just a story about stormy and trump having a cup of tea at trump tower, who cares. stormy having a one night affair or whatever you want to call it -- a one night stand with donald trump, people would care. who would care? donald trump would care because it would impact his campaign for the presidency and so the judge has made sure that certain guardrails have been placed,

that the prosecution is aware and let me be very clear, the prosecution will have told stormy's lawyer and stormy that she cannot go outside of these things. >> we're going to continue this conversation, it is just beginning. >> we're not taking our eyes off this trial, what is happening in the manhattan courthouse. we'll bring you every major update as we get them. up next, we'll talk to the reporter who broke that "access hollywood" tape story, about the pivotal turn we have taken into now the fishy financials at the heart of this case. and as we gear up for what could be a big, big witness taking the stand today, stormy daniels. bie stand today, stormy daniels.

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they become centers of their communities. real solutions for kids and communities at aft.org and we're back with special coverage of donald trump's hush money trial in new york, with adult film actress stormy daniels, who is at the center of the case, expected to take the stand any minute now. she'll be testifying about hush money payments she received in exchange for her silence about an affair she alleges with donald trump. donald trump has denied they had a relationship. back with us, nbc's vaughn hillyard from the courthouse, also joining us this morning, investigative reporter for "the new york times," david fairhold, who covered trump for years, including breaking the "access hollywood" story in 2016. vaughn, paint the picture for us. stormy daniels about to take the stand? >> reporter: right, we're

waiting for stormy daniels to enter into the courthouse. the publisher sally franklin of several of donald trump's past books, she has now left the stand. her time here is done inside of this lower manhattan courthouse. there is one additional passage that i wanted to read for you because from the book, this prosecution was using sally franklin as a conduit to actually read passages from several of his books to show that donald trump is somebody who is a micromanager, somebody who is very intrinsically involved in the finances of his company, and one passage from his book, think like a billionaire, she read this, here is something else about god that every billionaire knows. no detail is too small to consider. if people see your signature at the bottom of the check, they know you're watching them, and they screw you less. the words of donald trump, testimony coming just one day

after two key trump organization employees who were the ones handling the checks and invoices for the ultimate execution of the reimbursement to michael cohen took the stand yesterday, and now you said it, we wait for stormy daniels to take the stand, about 18 years after her alleged affair with donald trump in lake tahoe. this was an alleged one night stand, but one that stormy daniels has chronicled extensively in a book and a recent documentary, and ultimately was prepared to allegedly share in just before the 2016 election. and that is when there was the scramble to ultimately have michael cohen secure a $130,000 payment to her, of course, david fairhold, i'll let you go back and forth with, is at the center of this, with his "washington post" piece on "access

hollywood" and what propelled the two sides to begin negotiating the sell of her story in the efforts to quiet it before the 2016 election. >> it has been a long time coming. it has been years, decades since the alleged affair. vaughn, please keep us posted. we can tell our viewers right now there is a side bar happening where the legal counsel for both trump as well as the prosecutors are talking with the judge at the judge's area there in the courtroom outside of ear shot, usually, of the witnesses and the jurors who are inside. our reporting is that trump remains at the defense table, chatting with his lawyer emil bove and we're minutes away, we believe, from stormy daniels arriving to take that witness stand, spotted at the courthouse this morning. also there, behind trump is one of his family members eric trump, who is in the courtroom today. david, vaughn talked about your reporting, we heard about your

reporting come up in some of the testimony, like when hope hicks took the stand and described what was happening during the time that these allegations surfaced and when they were trying to hide stormy daniels' story. the prosecution says trump's team wanted to silence stormy daniels because of the damage done to his campaign when your story came out about the "access hollywood" tape, remind us what kind of fallout they were dealing with at that time. >> well, in the days after the tape, you saw something really unusual, even within the republican party that tolerated so much bad behavior, so much sort of unprecedented behavior from trump in that campaign season, even those hard core supporters started to walk away. paul ryan actually said he disinvited trump to an event in his home state of wisconsin, others were refusing to be seen with him for a few days. it seemed like at that point there was a rupture between the candidate and the party, where maybe trump had gone a little

bit too far. and in the end, nothing is too far for any of those republicans and they all came back. at that moment, you can understand trump's motivation, wanted to make sure there wasn't another news item that would push the people farther away. >> and, david, as we continue to monitor what is going on inside the courtroom, that one side bar that ana was speaking about concluded but the judge asked for another side bar, right after the attorneys had returned to their table and so the side bar is right now, the second side bar is over. david, what do you expect prosecutors to focus on with stormy daniels? >> when they question stormy daniels, don't expect it will be a lot about the initial encounter in lake tahoe. what they will focus on is trump's personal involvement in this. when she was paid off by michael cohen, what was she told about who wanted her to be paid off,

why she was being paid off, what was trump's role in arranging, identifying -- >> david, i just want to note, forgive me for interrupting, stormy daniels has just been called to the stand to give testimony in this criminal trial involving hush money payments of stormy daniels dating back to around the election and her story being covered up is the alleged crime. and those payments and the reimbursements to michael cohen at the center of this case. so, we're now awaiting to see what the very first question to stormy daniels will be as she walked to the bench, behind trump, we're told, up to the stand. stormy is entering, trump is -- when she came in, and i'm reading this in real time, so the document is moving a little bit on me here, it says trump takes a good look at her and then looks down. the clerk has sworn her in. she says, yes, she sits down,

and we're just awaiting, again, the details of how this questioning is going to go. david, as we're looking at this document and hoping to get some more content to report out about her testimony that is literally just about to get under way, she is just telling her name, the name is daniels, she also goes by stephanie clifford, her real name, and stormy daniels is her acting name, what do you think the prosecutors are going to get into with her related to these payments? because as we understand it, she wasn't directly tied to how the payments went into the books, right? she didn't have the direct conversations with trump or cohen about the payments. that was keith davidson who is already taking the stand in this trial. >> i think she'll talk about motivation, why were they paying her off, what did she hear from

michael cohen about why they wanted to silence her right then. and also, again, what was trump's role in all this, can anybody tell her, look, i'm doing this because trump told me to do this, can they establish trump's motivation or trump's personal role in the payoffs? we already know the mechanics, she can tell us the why and the who. >> vaughn hillyard, outside the courthouse, take us inside. >> reporter: right, i think it is important to set up here, when david in "the washington post" published the access hollywood story on october 7th, that led to text messages being sent between the "national enquirer" editor dylan howard and keith davidson, who is the attorney representing stormy daniels. less than 36 hours later, this evidence has already been provided to the jury, these text messages, less than 36 hours after david's story, the "access hollywood" story dropped, the message was sent by dylan howard, the "national enquirer" editor, directly to keith

davidson, making it clear that it would, quote, her talking be the final nail in the coffin. that is what led then a day after that to keith davidson and dylan howard being connected to michael cohen on october 10th, 2016, and in those weeks that followed, that is what led to the negotiations of the storytelling in the clear understanding, in the clear eagerness to have her story bought by michael cohen and donald trump. right here she takes the stand here to immediately begin answering questions including, yes, if stormy daniels is the name she intends to go by inside of the courtroom. >> vaughn, please stand by, david, thank you so much for offering your insights. right now we have the prosecution asking her some basic questions, by the way we should note she is going by stormy daniels on the stand. she was asked by the prosecution which name she prefers, if she prefers stormy daniels or stephanie clifford, she said stormy daniels. at this point, they're just laying some of the ground work on who she is, her background,

she talked about growing up in louisiana, saying she was born and raised in baton rouge, her parents split up when she was 4, she was raised mostly by a single working mom, went to a strict elementary school, middle school, so they're really taking the jurors through her life story, briefly, taking them up to, you know, she graduated the top ten in her class, she said, when it came to this high school that she was at, a magnate high school, received a scholarship from texas a&m, did take college class, she said when she was in high school and the color from the courtroom is she is speaking very quickly and is being asked to slow down for the court reporter. she talks about being in the equestrian club, was a member, it appears, of the ballet company.

she shoveled manure where her horses were boarded, later i went on to dancing and she's always been a dancer is what she says, mostly looks like ballet and jazz and they're still filling in the rest of the documents. so, let me bring our legal analyst here into the conversation. just help us understand, catherine, what they're doing in terms of establishing who stormy daniels is, why they have to go into this far back in her story? >> i always tell my witnesses, i want the jury to get to know you. so before we get to this is what happened on this day, and i was a victim of a crime or the defendant did this, we're going to give a little bit of the background of your life, because sometimes, like, why do i have to talk about this, so they can know you, so they know you're telling the truth, where you worked, where you went to school, your family. this is their way of having the jury get to know her as a person and finding her credible when she speaks.

she's not going to talk about falsifying business records. first, it is a little bit of background about her. >> susan hoffinger is doing the questioning of stormy daniels. there is a big team with the manhattan attorney general's office. do you think it is strategic to have a woman questioning stormy daniels through this sensitive part of testimony that is to come? >> i think in this stair scenar yes. sometimes you see more so on the defense, sometimes on the prosecution, if there is a sexual crime, sometimes you want a female prosecutor or female defense attorney to address the witness because there is more of a bond and you don't want to look like a guy being a bully and who has no concept of the issues that a woman would go through, which is understandable. so, you know, susan hoffinger, this is not her first time, not her first rodeo, she's been on

both sides as a prosecutor and criminal defense attorney, so if anyone is fit for this type of questioning, it would be her. and to your point, seconds ago, you want to humanize that witness, you want the jury to like them and find them to be regular, no different than you, sometimes that's tears, even a juror -- a witness speaking quickly, that's a sign of anxiousness, like you might have or hope hicks who was crying because it is a nervous, difficult thing to do to testify in front of strangers. >> we're learning about stormy daniels' story. she talked about moving out of her mother's house, she moved out when she was 17, says my mother was neglectful and she disappeared for days at a time, she would vanish, it was at the time of my senior year, i left for a little bit, i considered myself an adult, so i moved out. daniels goes on to say, her mother was not an addict, but would disappear at times and to this day she doesn't know, she said her mother would just vanish and then the prosecutor asks have you supported yourself ever since, daniels, yes.

did you start doing other work, nude modelling? >> daniels, we had guest stars at the club and they would do aerial shows and because i was an actual dancer, you needed credits to be the headliner, she said i was like i want to do that, but you have to have some sort of credit, a reason to be the headliner, the reason to come in and be the star. daniels, you have to have credit, so i started posing to get the accolades. she says i went on to pose for magazines to get accolades to go on tour. hoffinger, how old were you when you started that work? stormy daniels, 21. hoffinger, did you work in the adult film industry? daniels, yes, we had contests in north america, the people who make the most were -- and then we're still typing here, so that's where we are in thi testimony from stormy daniels. danny, how critical is the testimony from stormy daniels to this case? >> there are two answers to that question. in terms of flashiness and in

terms of name recognition, stormy daniels is near the top, up there with michael cohen. in terms of substantive evidence, not that important in my view. let me say it this way, there have been other witnesses that are far more important to the prosecution's case. arguably even today and yesterday, names that you haven't heard of before, people who are inside the trump organization who handled the finances, you could argue that yesterday a huge portion of the people's case was made with witnesses that most people have never heard of. and then you had someone like stormy daniels, which i took the position that they arguably didn't need to call her, i think they do for two main reasons, number one, to book end and put a name to the face of the transaction from cohen to daniels. and then also i think she'll testify about the value of her story, and how that value, like any other market increased as the election approached. so she is significant to the prosecution's case, but in terms of what evidence they need from

her, it is really minimal. this is more about context, this is more about name recognition, the jury will be riveted in a way that maybe they weren't riveted yesterday with all the accounting testimony. so, this is going to be a good witness for the prosecution, even if she is limited in her testimony, i don't think she is going to be very limited and also i was wondering if she might sort of go off script and maybe say some outrageous things, doesn't seem that way right now. but right now she appears to be responding to what the prosecution's asking her, but when the defense gets up, there is a possibility she might throw out a few grenades if they ask questions that are ill advised. they asked questions of stormy daniels at their own risk, the defense does, because she is not really under the control the way a cooperating witness would be of the prosecution, so, she could really say anything and she arguably has a motive to do so to stay in the public light. >> and right now she is still just talking about her background, they're asking, did

you continue to write and direct films, how old were you at the time, she was 23 when she was offered a contract in adult film writing and if she continues to write and direct films, she says, yes, i still do. she describes the types of movies she has written and directed, and she says there is the kinds that aren't scripted, they're just sort of scenes, and then there are actual movies that have sex, she says she started directing when she was 23, starts listing some of the names of the different movies she has directed. catherine, is it risky to put stormy daniels on the stand if you're the prosecutor? >> no. because -- and i agree with danny, she didn't have to be called. her lawyer was called. he confirmed the payment, the banker confirmed the wire. but i always felt as a prosecutor you don't want to hide a witness, you don't want a jury thinking why didn't they call her, unless she was going to be horrific and she's willing to testify, i would put her on. i think the cross examination is going to be done by susan necheles who on that defense

team is the most experienced in terms of doing cross examination. so, and, again, the woman point, so i don't think she will open the door to some outrageous testimony coming out of miss daniels' mouth unless she volunteers that, which would not make her look good. >> jeremy? >> completes the narrative to everyone's point. you don't need her there to prove the case, but you need her there if you want to complete the narrative and not seem like you're hiding something. the danger for the defense, if the defense takes the tactic this is a shakedown and she's a distortionist blackmailer, they're going to drop and detonate their own grenade and open that door that that limited sexual story that judge merchan said we're not going to go into the details, well, does it open up the door to that, does it open up the door to any other conversations that occurred, there is a lot of fear that the prosecution, pardon me, the defense might have if they go too far off course, and open that door. so, if she needed, again, she

helps, and she is essential to complete that story, that narrative, she doesn't prove the elements and there is a danger from the defense that the grenades will be dropped on their own, not thrown indirectly or directly from stormy daniels. >> all right, everybody here, please stay with us. jose, i know you and katie have some things to discuss as well. >> we do. thank you very much. katie as we look at what is happening inside the courtroom right now, they're asking her what movies she has been a part of, she's been in music videos, she describes the different types of movies that she wrote and directed. including a comedy show, has a podcast, she's, according to our producers, she's clearly nervous, speaking quickly, but hoffinger is giving her an opportunity to tell her story and to show she is not just an adult film actress, she has experience in music, books, and comedy. i'm just wondering, and we're

talking about the possibility of grenades, right, being lobbed, when she is asked by the defense, but what is the prosecution trying to establish about stormy daniels when they essentially go through her curriculum vitae? >> they're trying to destroy stereotypes, jose. a lot of us have certain preconceived notions about adult film stars. a lot of us have preconceived judgments, more importantly, about the quality or the character of a person who would do adult films. and what they're doing is humanizing the witness. that is always so important. there is a job, right, to do. >> sometimes it may be a difficult task to make someone who lives or works in maybe an unusual ambience to make that relevant to people who maybe don't have access to that. >> in doing so, in creating the

humanizing kind of environments of these questions of stormy daniels, you have now heard that her mother was neglectful, that was her own adjective, so she moved up at 17 because her mother would be gone for days. so, it is things like this that i think are really important for the jury to understand that this woman doesn't exist in a vacuum, and then they're leading up to the chronology, jose, of her actually interacting with donald trump. and how and why that ended up happening. >> this is really the key part in hoffinger is asking about whether in 2009 she explored running for a republican senate seat in louisiana. daniels says yes. hoffinger, tell me about that. here's what daniels said, i got an email from a friend in louisiana, she said it was a draft campaign against republican david vitter, i got really mad, they were using my name and image for a candidate who was running on a platform,

antiwoman, and said some unsavory things so i jumped on board and said i was a better choice than this guy, even i was a better choice than this guy, made for some fun campaign slogans, she said, i have to admit. so, hoffinger, and this is interesting, your thoughts, you would be running as a republican? yes, correct. >> yeah, again, the humanization of somebody, so you now see stormy daniels has a sense of humor. you see she actually was politically aware. these are things if you're a juror, if you don't know about her, creates a relatability thing. perhaps you're looking at stormy daniels in a different lens if you're on the jury. >> right now, hoffinger has focused her, let's go directly to -- take your attention to july of 2006. were you working at a celebrity golf tournament in lake tahoe? daniels, yes. were you working for wicked pictures, adult film company?

yes. daniels, so, we worked with sponsor on one of the holes on the golf course and we had a table where celebrities would come through and pose for pictures. it was myself and the owner of the company and some staff, you would stay at your hole with the company's logo. this is the description of how and when she met donald trump. >> exactly. and this is important because, again, these things did not happen in a vacuum. they didn't happen without anybody being aware. this is how the foundation is being laid for the prosecution to show how she met donald trump and how it led to that, quote, interaction, that she had with him, no matter how fleeting, perhaps that was. >> and vaughn hillyard, outside the courthouse, important because the meeting between stormy daniels and donald trump, we're showing the picture right now that is not in doubt. it is just what happened after.

>> reporter: right. stormy daniels alleges that she went to donald trump's room, and donald trump has denied that any of that took place. and, of course, donald trump in the years since has repeatedly attacked stormy daniels, of course, called her horse face, he has attacked her credibility, repeatedly, and stormy daniels on the other hand has been quite public, you know, back in march of 2018, folks will recall when she sat down for that "60 minutes" interview and we have testimony already from david pecker who said that he got a phone call from donald trump after stormy daniels did that extensive interview with anderson cooper on "60 minutes" and donald trump was aghast and told david pecker they had an agreement with stormy daniels did that interview on "60 minutes," and donald trump was aghast, and he told david pecker they had an agreement with stormy daniels, and every time she said donald trump she owed him $1 million,

and that was in march of 2018, and an entire month later, donald trump was saying he did not know anything about the agreement and david pecker testified to the opposite of that. and with the likes of dillon howard and michael cohen directly, and i think they would be wrong not to mention michael avenatti who is serving four years in prisona federal judge sentencing him to four years in prison after he stole from her money from her book. it's a moment in this criminal trial. >> vaughn, thank you. stand by. i am looking back at the document and what is happening right now inside that courtroom where she's really describing her interactions with trump when they first met.

did you meet donald trump on the celebrity golf tournament in tahoe? yes, i did. it was a brief encounter, and they would take their shots. it wasn't very much. daniels recalls trump saying, oh, you direct, too, you must be smart. what did you know about mr. trump? daniels:he was a golfer and had a tv show. "celebrity apprentice." i am from louisiana, so it was a big deal. >> did you know his approximate age? >> daniels: he talked to all the girls, and he asked what i

directed. he asked what i directed. it was called "three wishes." i saw him talking to another gentleman who were with him. we are still learning more about what she's saying. i will continue to keep an eye on this. jeremy, you got the last question last time around. we are really getting now at the heart of the encounter, and we are going towards, you know, what she said transpired between them in the sexual encounter that would eventually be, you know, the story that donald trump wanted to cover up around 2016 during the election. where do you expect the prosecution to go now? >> well, it's not going to go into details, because you have to understand, what is the purpose of silencing? not because she went to dinner or met movies or met at a golf tournament. they will have to move into the

meat and potatoes, the substance of what happened between them. that's going to be the foundation. to everybody's point, this is not somebody that needs to go into detail. you keep her on too long and she becomes a distraction and story by herself and that's what the prosecution doesn't want to do. maybe the defense wants to make it about a porn star extorting. >> they are introducing some photos as evidence here from that time. it says that she's asked what is depicted in that photo, and daniels said there's a photo of myself and mr. trump in the gift room, and the viewers are seeing the famous photo of trump and

daniels, and it's the picture you are looking at right now on the screen that we believe the jurors are seeing. it's listed as exhibit number 226 in this trial, the donald trump hush-money trial. also, since they have been introducing this evidence, she talked about how it was another gentleman who was with donald trump, who asked her for donald trump if she would like to have dinner with him in this brief exchange when they were in the gift room. it says daniels leaned out of her seat to point to trump, and said in the blue jacket, and this is in response of her being asked to identify him. now they are looking at these photos. it appears of donald trump and stormy daniels together.

hoffenger asked daniels, what is this? he's wearing this yellow polo shirt. we're, again, leading up to more of the story of this encounter. katharine, what are your thoughts? >> well, this is, again, this is 34 counts of falsifying business records, which she can't speak to. she can speak to the conspiracy to promote donald trump's election by unlawful means because he would not want the public to know he was 60 years old and had an affair with the 27-year-old porn star. just have her on to establish that there was this affair, whatever you want to call it, and that's the reason why she was paid money to silence her

because he could not let this information come out to the electorate before the election. >> now she's being asked what the bodyguard said to her. she answers, mr. trump was interested in having me join him for dinner, and she said i was not interested, so she said no, with an expletive in front, and his name was keith and gave him my nom and i saved that number in my phone and created a contact for keith in july. as we are reading the details, obviously the jury is hearing directly from stormy daniels. i will be curious to hear from our reporters who are in there what the jurors reaction is during all this, and we will, of course, pass that along as we get it. if you are the defense and this is all coming out, what are you saying to donald trump right now? >> first, you fight to keep lot from this coming in, and they

tried that and did not succeed. there's nothing to speak to your client about at this point. >> and yet, donald trump is somebody who in previous courtrooms has, you know, made a big scene, has acted out. i assume that this is a testimony that would stir some emotions, certainly, and knowing he has the family members in the courtroom today. eric trump is there. >> it might. what you just read, that testimony has nothing to do with the evidence, the whole part about the bodyguard asking for the number, but it's an excellent piece of evidence for the people because it shows the seediness of the whole affair, trump sending his bodyguard to go and get the number from stormy daniels and get her to have dinner and how she was reluctant to do it. that has nothing to do with the

reimbursement to michael cohen from the trump organization, and prosecutors know what they are doing, those features is what they are bringing out and that's why stormy daniels's testimony will be helpful and why the defense would fight to keep lot of it out, and they fought to keep descriptions of the sexual activities out, and the judge said something to the effect, you can talk about sex, but specific genitilia, that's not allowed. that's the world we are living in where you have to parse what stormy daniels can and can't testify about concerning trump. so far net positive for the prosecution. >> they are still talking about her saving trump's bodyguard's name and contact information in her phone at the time. she saved him as keith trump as

her contact. the attorney asked, why did you put trump there? i didn't know keith's name. do you still have keith's number in your phone today? yes. we were going to dinner with everybody at the company, and i didn't want to be around and -- and what better excuse do you have than this, than to have dinner with donald trump. i said, really? he said, it's a great story. your reaction to this testimony and why is it so important that keith trump contact was saved into her phone? >> again, another piece of foundational building block for credibility. it's not the stormy daniels' story, and she's not going to save the day, and